Anime Debate

Barbobot

-the Pirate King
Retired
I'm sure though if you are a person who doesn't mind dubs or are fond of them there'd be more of an incentive. I know recently I've grown to like dubs a fair amount for some shows. I just watched the Darker than Black dub and it's fairly well done. Baccano and RomeoxJuliet both have great dubs that actually add a bit more to the show that japanese really can't. Though at the same time I realize that there is a large portion of the fansub consuming community that goes "ewwwww dub. Keep away. Burn at the stake!" which is a bit unfortunate.
They do need to make their subs a bit better on the eyes though. I remember that topic coming up at the fansubber Otakon panel that ANN has on their video section. Nothing special is needed. Just give me some plain, clean white letters with a black outline so they can be clearly read. That's all I need to be happy with the shows I wouldn't want to watch dubbed.

@Hiroyuki
As for the convenience thing, well I guess for me that just doesn't really count. I have just about all my anime on externals that I don't keep attached to my computer as I have a laptop I move around quite often. Thus the spontaneity is gone cause I either have to go get my external, plug it into my computer, and hook my computer to my TV if I want to watch it on that. Or get the DVD out, put it in my PS3 for the TV or my computer. Though I figure a fair amount of people don't have this problem as they might not move their laptop around much or just have a desktop and leave things hooked up.
 

pjcountach

-chi
Kouhai
@ Hiroyuki
I actually like the menus and...elusive extras. I usually check out the trailers, I've found some excellent shows that way, and then can choose between sub or dub.
I prefer to watch sub, but I've realized that quite a few of the more recent dubs are actually quite good...friends made me do it
dry.gif


Also, unlike some people with terabytes of space, I have a whopping 40 Gigs free,(well, not anymore), so I eagerly watch for new licenses on the downloaded shows so I can buy it and clear space for the next show.
---I also have something of a book collector complex. Seeing the dvd box art on my shelf makes me happy, especially because I don't have to memorize a list, I can just show it off. or quickly remember what I wanted to watch and reach for it without waiting for my computer to warm up...yes, it runs slow.

In the end I treat fansubs like pre-license marketing, I read the synopsis, watch the show, and buy series I finish.
---alternatively I read reviews at Themanime and make an educated guess with my wallet.
 

NeoScott

-san
Kouhai
I buy the anime I love and I'll buy anime i like when it comes in a complete season, at a good price.

Cost really is an issue with me, but i belive some companys deserve my money.

I'll be buying eden of the east, and All of Sayonara Zetsubou Sensei when they come out in canada.

There a ton of anime i'll wait for the series to come out, i wont go into detail.

I would rather they realse the DVD with only subs, I HATE Dubs, Have you ever seen Teknoman? That anime was so poorly dubbed, the voices sucked, and I COULD HEAR THAT THEY HATED THERE JOBS. sad to say i paid $20 cnd to find a new reason to kill everyone.

anyways, I do buy anime only for the eps, I don't care for speical features. I really can't care about art work and music videos and printable stickers when the sticker sheet will cost me more then the dvd did. And really, WHY do I need PRINTABLE ANYTHING off a dvd? I have the internet, I can google ANYTHING I want.


QUOTE
Also, unlike some people with terabytes of space, I have a whopping 40 Gigs free,(well, not anymore), so I eagerly watch for new licenses on the downloaded shows so I can buy it and clear space for the next show. 

Can I suggest you buy some blank dvd's?
 

king of cole

New Member
Kouhai
I really don't understand why torrents are illigal, (other than the courts and law) i use torrents to watch my piss poor quality anime just months after its first release, it takes up to 4 years for them to produce one dvd in english, i think i will watch the fansubed till i get the OFFICAL set, Dose anyone agree?

i have downloaded ikki tousan, neon genesis, maburaho, chobots, X TV, GITS, cowboy bebop and Scryed and deleated them when i got the entire sets, now i burn copies and use them so i don't damage my hard earned collection.
but even coping your own dvds for your own privet use is illigal too, GOOD DAMN LAW SYSTEM, they make it out that your a criminal just by enjoying your self.
the gov is cruppted and nixon must be up to his arsehole in brinstone right about now.
 

Dalriada

-dono
Sempai
QUOTE I really don't understand why torrents are illigal, (other than the courts and law)

Other than the courts and law, nothing is illegal.
It's the definition of 'illegal'.
wink.gif




QUOTE i have downloaded ikki tousan, neon genesis, maburaho, chobots, X TV, GITS, cowboy bebop and Scryed and deleated them when i got the entire sets, now i burn copies and use them so i don't damage my hard earned collection.

The question is : do you buy everything you download ?

Some people will say "I download animes, and then I buy the good ones", but there's two problems :
-What if you (a generic you, not a 'you' you) are very choosy ? You watch 30 animes series per year, and you buy only one ? There's a problem.
-Why are you watching the bad ones ? They are bad, you acknowledge it since you don't buy them, and yet you watch them ? Have you a problem ?

Otherwise, I agree with you on the need of a private copy. But as often, legitimate uses are screwed because of illegitimate ones.
 

warita200

Tai Youkai
Sempai
QUOTE (Dalriada @ Feb 11 2010, 11:54 AM)
The question is : do you buy everything you download ?

Some people will say "I download animes, and then I buy the good ones", but there's two problems :
-What if you (a generic you, not a 'you' you) are very choosy ? You watch 30 animes series per year, and you buy only one ? There's a problem.
-Why are you watching the bad ones ? They are bad, you acknowledge it since you don't buy them, and yet you watch them ? Have you a problem ?


on the other hand, why should I buy dozens of animes, that are crappy? I am very picky and I download more than I ever buy. Thats just how it goes. I gladly support the studios, that produced something worthy buying and refuse to pay for something, that isnt good enough. Fortunately the internet allows me to check the animes out before spending money.
biggrin.gif
As for the argument, that I dont pay for the "bad" animes I am watching..... well, this doesnt actually do any harm to the studio that produced the anime. Because the anime is already produced and I am not going to buy so or so. To the studio it makes no difference in the end, whether I watch it or not, coz there is no money coming from me either way.
 

Dalriada

-dono
Sempai
QUOTE on the other hand, why should I buy dozens of animes, that are crappy?

But they are crappy ! Why do you watch them ? Are you masochist ?

Usually, this argument is hypocritical.
It uses two scales of quality : on the one hand, animes that are good enough to be watched and on the other hand those that are good enough to be bought. Which leads to some situations like "I watch five hours of animes per weeks, and I buy the good ones. How many animes are good enough ? I don't know, 3 or 4 since I've begun watching animes".
It's hypocritical, because you just have to watch them and say "not good enough" everytime (or almost everytime, you still need a cheap alibi).
 

monsta666

-the bee's knees
Staff member
Fansub TV Team
QUOTE (Dalriada @ Feb 12 2010, 09:34 AM)Usually, this argument is hypocritical.
It uses two scales of quality : on the one hand, animes that are good enough to be watched and on the other hand those that are good enough to be bought. Which leads to some situations like "I watch five hours of animes per weeks, and I buy the good ones. How many animes are good enough ? I don't know, 3 or 4 since I've begun watching animes".
It's hypocritical, because you just have to watch them and say "not good enough" everytime (or almost everytime, you still need a cheap alibi).
While what you say is true and can apply to many forms of media in general (be it music, films or games etc) I think we need to make a distinction with anime. The reason I say this is because anime is not readily available, at least less so than other media.

If I want to test music or films to see whether it worth buying I listen to the radio or watch TV. It is all free and it is not illegal yet it is a cheap way of testing the product for "free" before making the final purchase. There are plenty of things that are only worth trying out once and not everything is worth buying. So while you could argue it is hypocritical it is a fact of life, especially if ones disposal income is more limited (which is more relevant in this current economic climate).

Now I am not saying that downloading anime or watching illegal streams will have no effect on demand (downloading does have an effect). Whether it is positive or negative is another debate altogether. One thing should be noted however; the less money we spend on a product the more prepared we are to accept mediocre work. If I pay 50 cents for an anime episode I will have a lower expectation on its quality and will watch more mediocre series. Conversely, if the price is raised then my expectation of quality will increase. Seeing as anime is generally perceived as over-priced (compared to other media such as films/TV series) then it stands to reason that anime series must be considerably better than other media to justify its high price, at least that is the expectation the consumer will have. So it shouldn't be surprising if overall demand is lower as people will expect more that much more. A premium product demands premium quality otherwise there will be no sale.
 

Dalriada

-dono
Sempai
QUOTE While what you say is true and can apply to many forms of media in general (be it music, films or games etc) I think we need to make a distinction with anime. The reason I say this is because anime is not readily available, at least less so than other media.

How many people here read the fan-translated chapters of One Piece, Naruto or Bleach (or watch the animes) ?

I agree with your argument (although there another way to make an opinion on a work : reading reviews or critics), but I still think it's mainly a cheap alibi (a bit more expensive than before, but still cheap) because the animes and mangas that are most often 'pirated' are the most successful and the most famous, i.e. those who will be quickly translated in english (or french, for me) by an official editor.
 

warita200

Tai Youkai
Sempai
QUOTE (Dalriada @ Feb 12 2010, 02:34 AM)
But they are crappy ! Why do you watch them ? Are you masochist ?


I dont watch them, thats the point. I want to check the animes out, before I buy them. And for the few I watch and dont buy them, well, thats life!!!!!

And as for the reviews.... if I would rely on that, I wouldnt have watched tons of good animes, because the reviews made the anime sound bad and besides, the opinions are influenced by the subjective opinion of the writer. At the same time I have read numerous times wonderfull plot descriptions and reviews about animes, that suck big time. No way I can rely on that.
 

warita200

Tai Youkai
Sempai
I decided to refresh this thread with something I have noticed lately.

A little background info on my situation: my dorm has banned torrent clients so I had to say good bye to torrent downloading..... it is hard... yeahh. But internet offers other possibilities, albeit not as comfortable ones as torrents. I mean, there is nothing easier than to search isohunt or tokyotosho, add it to your client and just wait for it to be finished, right?

Now I have to spend considerable time looking for direct downloading of my anime or resort to crappy quality of crunchy roll and similar places. Now, I dont mind watching my anime online, but I want to keep some animes for later. I dont download much and never did, but I do have some favourites and I want to keep those. Unfortunately, most of my favs are licenced, right? So that rules FTV out and many other places.

So, that leads me to what I wanted to say in the first place. I discovered few anime sites, that offer direct downloading.... but you got to be a premium member.... meaning, you have to pay ~5$ per months or buy a year membership..... either way, it left me wondering, how exactly this works.

Basically, offering anime for downloading is already balancing at the line of illegality itself. But for money? I think that crosses the line for sure. I think it works like this..... some dude has an awesome collection of animes, he joins with some other friends who also have libraries of their own, they open a site for direct downloading. But while at it, why not make some bucks from it too? I suppose running a site like this doesnt come for free..... but hey, Daft doesnt ask for money, right? So, they are actually making profits.

Now, considering the other posts I have written in this thread, maybe you wonder about my sudden change of heart.... but somehow the audacity of the said sites makes me angry.

Also, one of the sites I had a closer look at was offering:

1 months: 5$
1 year: 35$

This reminded me of rapidshare, that asks fpr 6,99$ per month and I bet the quality of service is considerably higher, right? I mean, you can download all kinds of things from rapidshare at considerably higher speeds too, but an anime site has only anime and there is only that much of interest. Oo Isnt that a little expensive for what you get?
 

nijlandp

-sama
Sempai
If the site really asks for money for a download it must be over the line of the copyright issues. Hmm, you may be right about getting angry at those sites. They profit from the work of the free fansub groups...How can you ask money for something a volunteer (who him/herself doesn't ask for money) did to help others?
Getting an account at rapidshare would be a better option since those prices really are over the top. It is better to get it from there and if you like it to buy the anime itself.
 

Ausdoerrt

-sama
Retired
If warita's living in the States then getting RS membership is a waste of money, since MU is a lot faster there, and free membership download rules aren't nearly as restrictive as RS either.

I don't have torrent in my dorms either, but Animetake or any other community that makes MU anime mirrors for all the new torrents works just fine. And if you need to DL a lot there's always "happy hour".

And of course don't forget that FTV here also has direct download options, even if the new episodes are uploaded a bit later sometimes, it's another great option that's absolutely free.
 
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