Scientology
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I do believe I agree with you, Dalriada. I'd doubt that Anonymous is some highly organized group. It would much more easily be a couple individuals reaping the benefits of the internet to further their personal opinions/agendas.
But in the case that there could be some sort of anti-conspiracy conspiracy going on here, well, that could be cool, too. I have heard some people who think some of the higher-ups in some prominent Christian religion are behind it... but that's really doubtful. But you never know...
It's cool, at any rate.
QUOTE (julezia @ Jan 27 2008, 03:19 PM)I thought the video was interesting and kinda entertaining... but I'm not really sure what can be expected to happen.
I don't know much about scientology... all I know I learned from a south park episode (really funny btw, if you haven't seen it, watch it!)
Oh yeah, I've watched that one. Good stuff!
But in the case that there could be some sort of anti-conspiracy conspiracy going on here, well, that could be cool, too. I have heard some people who think some of the higher-ups in some prominent Christian religion are behind it... but that's really doubtful. But you never know...
It's cool, at any rate.
QUOTE (julezia @ Jan 27 2008, 03:19 PM)I thought the video was interesting and kinda entertaining... but I'm not really sure what can be expected to happen.
I don't know much about scientology... all I know I learned from a south park episode (really funny btw, if you haven't seen it, watch it!)
Oh yeah, I've watched that one. Good stuff!
QUOTE I do believe I agree with you, Dalriada. I'd doubt that Anonymous is some highly organized group. It would much more easily be a couple individuals reaping the benefits of the internet to further their personal opinions/agendas.
It's not even as organized as this.
The origin of anonymous is that on some imageboards (a forum where people post images and their comments. For example 4chan.org, don't go on this site if you still have some faith in humanity. Or if you're at work and don't want to be fired), posters don't have aliases, so the messages' poster is seen as 'anonymous'.
The joke being that people say that only one person post, and this perso is Anonymous.
So anonymous is virtually everyone posting on those various sites.
It's not even as organized as this.
The origin of anonymous is that on some imageboards (a forum where people post images and their comments. For example 4chan.org, don't go on this site if you still have some faith in humanity. Or if you're at work and don't want to be fired), posters don't have aliases, so the messages' poster is seen as 'anonymous'.
The joke being that people say that only one person post, and this perso is Anonymous.
So anonymous is virtually everyone posting on those various sites.
People can belive in what ever they want and waste their money on what ever they want. I think I'll continue to avoid Scientology and keep my money.
QUOTE (Dalriada @ Jan 27 2008, 08:50 PM)
It's not even as organized as this.
The origin of anonymous is that on some imageboards (a forum where people post images and their comments. For example 4chan.org, don't go on this site if you still have some faith in humanity. Or if you're at work and don't want to be fired), posters don't have aliases, so the messages' poster is seen as 'anonymous'.
The joke being that people say that only one person post, and this perso is Anonymous.
So anonymous is virtually everyone posting on those various sites.
...how do you know this? Why couldn't this anti-scientologist "organization" be separate from "anonymous" posters on some weird websites? I'm not saying that cannot be the case, but how can you determine this group Anonymous is derived from some internet forum joke?
But dang, I was thinking about how you called it a possible "stand alone complex", and I realized that it actually fits. I thought, "cool!" Dang, I need to watch GitS again...
It's not even as organized as this.
The origin of anonymous is that on some imageboards (a forum where people post images and their comments. For example 4chan.org, don't go on this site if you still have some faith in humanity. Or if you're at work and don't want to be fired), posters don't have aliases, so the messages' poster is seen as 'anonymous'.
The joke being that people say that only one person post, and this perso is Anonymous.
So anonymous is virtually everyone posting on those various sites.
...how do you know this? Why couldn't this anti-scientologist "organization" be separate from "anonymous" posters on some weird websites? I'm not saying that cannot be the case, but how can you determine this group Anonymous is derived from some internet forum joke?
But dang, I was thinking about how you called it a possible "stand alone complex", and I realized that it actually fits. I thought, "cool!" Dang, I need to watch GitS again...
QUOTE ...how do you know this? Why couldn't this anti-scientologist "organization" be separate from "anonymous" posters on some weird websites? I'm not saying that cannot be the case, but how can you determine this group Anonymous is derived from some internet forum joke?
It was launched of the usual dark places associated with Anonymous.
I'm not saying that there's not organized groups inside (there is). I'm saying that it's not a single group itself, and it's not lead by a single groupe.
QUOTE
But dang, I was thinking about how you called it a possible "stand alone complex", and I realized that it actually fits. I thought, "cool!" Dang, I need to watch GitS again...
I'm not sure if it fits perfectly, but it's so geeky that I will do like it did.
It was launched of the usual dark places associated with Anonymous.
I'm not saying that there's not organized groups inside (there is). I'm saying that it's not a single group itself, and it's not lead by a single groupe.
QUOTE
But dang, I was thinking about how you called it a possible "stand alone complex", and I realized that it actually fits. I thought, "cool!" Dang, I need to watch GitS again...
I'm not sure if it fits perfectly, but it's so geeky that I will do like it did.
QUOTE (Dalriada @ Jan 28 2008, 01:07 AM) I'm not sure if it fits perfectly, but it's so geeky that I will do like it did.
Yeah, it could possibly be a standalone complex, depending upon what's really going on here. It's just to cool a comparison to pass up.
There might not be a group/individual who's behind it. It may have started with some random tube video designed just mess with Scientologists, some others may have gotten inspired/provoked by it, post their own random video, so on, so forth, etc., etc.
Who knows, "Anonymous" might just end up being a popular trend, maybe a cultural phenomenon, or maybe it'll just be a couple random tube videos that don't end up doing anything at all.
...it's still cool, at any rate.
Yeah, it could possibly be a standalone complex, depending upon what's really going on here. It's just to cool a comparison to pass up.
There might not be a group/individual who's behind it. It may have started with some random tube video designed just mess with Scientologists, some others may have gotten inspired/provoked by it, post their own random video, so on, so forth, etc., etc.
Who knows, "Anonymous" might just end up being a popular trend, maybe a cultural phenomenon, or maybe it'll just be a couple random tube videos that don't end up doing anything at all.
...it's still cool, at any rate.
Last night I was checking up on the current going-on's of Scientology for sheer curiosity. It seems like the "Anonymous movement" is still going on, which is sweet to see, and it looks like the CoS is pulling out its big guns in order to prevent the proliferation of any "unbased slander".
I found a couple videos I think are interesting. The first is official footage of Tom Cruise discussing his firm belief in the religion.
Tom Cruise's Convictions
And this one is a couple years old. It's an official BBC special on Scientology. It gets to a pretty freakin' amazing climax at part #4, I must say, but it definitely shows some of the tactics used the the CoS to eliminate any possible form of negativity about the church, using tactics they claim to have forgone many years ago. Freaky stuff!
BBC Special
I remember a while back in this thread it was stated that the arguments were all too one-sided against Scientology. Really, it's almost impossible for anyone educated about it to have anything nice to say, because the "religion" (I know the UK doesn't offically recognize it as a religion, I don't think America does either, at least for tax purposes) gives nothing good to say about itself, other than the promise that you'll love it if you join. Anything else they mention about themselves is nothing but vague nonsense which amounts to absolutely nothing.
They use the Holocaust as a tool to promote their anti-psychiatry campaign, which is just downright dishonorable, in my book. They implement a "fair game" policy against those who go against the religion (basically, they dig up dirt on you, and make sure you're not comfortable about it). Not to mention the huge number of horror stories about people who have joined, those who have left, and those who publicly deride the church. Speaking of horror stories, here's one more vid which sums them up. Although be warned, it is a disturbing watch, it made me sick, and that's saying something! I can't say for certain the sources are 100% legitimate, although much of it is based upon legal court documentation. The stories aren't exactly little-known.
Horror Stories
I found a couple videos I think are interesting. The first is official footage of Tom Cruise discussing his firm belief in the religion.
Tom Cruise's Convictions
And this one is a couple years old. It's an official BBC special on Scientology. It gets to a pretty freakin' amazing climax at part #4, I must say, but it definitely shows some of the tactics used the the CoS to eliminate any possible form of negativity about the church, using tactics they claim to have forgone many years ago. Freaky stuff!
BBC Special
I remember a while back in this thread it was stated that the arguments were all too one-sided against Scientology. Really, it's almost impossible for anyone educated about it to have anything nice to say, because the "religion" (I know the UK doesn't offically recognize it as a religion, I don't think America does either, at least for tax purposes) gives nothing good to say about itself, other than the promise that you'll love it if you join. Anything else they mention about themselves is nothing but vague nonsense which amounts to absolutely nothing.
They use the Holocaust as a tool to promote their anti-psychiatry campaign, which is just downright dishonorable, in my book. They implement a "fair game" policy against those who go against the religion (basically, they dig up dirt on you, and make sure you're not comfortable about it). Not to mention the huge number of horror stories about people who have joined, those who have left, and those who publicly deride the church. Speaking of horror stories, here's one more vid which sums them up. Although be warned, it is a disturbing watch, it made me sick, and that's saying something! I can't say for certain the sources are 100% legitimate, although much of it is based upon legal court documentation. The stories aren't exactly little-known.
Horror Stories
QUOTE (EggBeast @ Apr 21 2008, 09:45 AM)I found a couple videos I think are interesting. The first is official footage of Tom Cruise discussing his firm belief in the religion.
Tom Cruise's Convictions
And this one is a couple years old. It's an official BBC special on Scientology. It gets to a pretty freakin' amazing climax at part #4, I must say, but it definitely shows some of the tactics used the the CoS to eliminate any possible form of negativity about the church, using tactics they claim to have forgone many years ago. Freaky stuff!
BBC Special
The thing I find funny is most religions are really keen to convert you (sometimes too keen) and will never really ask for anything in return. On the other hand Scientology is very keen in taking your money before showing you it's benefits.. If the stuff is so brilliant why are they so reluctant to share it to the world?
Another thing that should be remembered is people like Tom Cruise get special treatment when entering the ahh religion/cult. They don't start at the first level like normal people. Can you name any religion that gives special treatment to celebrities?
QUOTE (EggBeast)I remember a while back in this thread it was stated that the arguments were all too one-sided against Scientology. Really, it's almost impossible for anyone educated about it to have anything nice to say, because the "religion" (I know the UK doesn't offically recognize it as a religion, I don't think America does either, at least for tax purposes) gives nothing good to say about itself, other than the promise that you'll love it if you join. Anything else they mention about themselves is nothing but vague nonsense which amounts to absolutely nothing.
I don't think Scientology is a religion in the UK (I'm not sure
). The Germans go one step further however and class it as a business! Or so I hear... The logic behind this is they think Scientology provides a service that you need to pay to use. With further investments you gain more benefits from the company. At first classing Scientology as a business seems kinda wacky but these Germans actually have the right idea (in my opinion anyway). What do you think?
As for religion and cults. In my eyes the difference between a religion and cult isn't so much about their ideologies but more to do with their structure. With a religion you do not HAVE to pay (it's only an option). And they will teach the ways for more or less nothing. On the other hand a cult will force you to pay money to join their group. Once in you then need to make a significant investment to go up the ladder. This doesn't happen with normal religions. You progress through the rankings via faithful service. Finally another thing that distinguishes religions from cults is the fact the many cults eventually force its followers to leave the general population. So it's followers become isolated from non followers.
As Scientology follows all these cult traits, in my eyes it is closer to a cult than a religion. Then again I don't mind calling it a business!
Seems more evil if we call it that!
Tom Cruise's Convictions
And this one is a couple years old. It's an official BBC special on Scientology. It gets to a pretty freakin' amazing climax at part #4, I must say, but it definitely shows some of the tactics used the the CoS to eliminate any possible form of negativity about the church, using tactics they claim to have forgone many years ago. Freaky stuff!
BBC Special
The thing I find funny is most religions are really keen to convert you (sometimes too keen) and will never really ask for anything in return. On the other hand Scientology is very keen in taking your money before showing you it's benefits.. If the stuff is so brilliant why are they so reluctant to share it to the world?
Another thing that should be remembered is people like Tom Cruise get special treatment when entering the ahh religion/cult. They don't start at the first level like normal people. Can you name any religion that gives special treatment to celebrities?
QUOTE (EggBeast)I remember a while back in this thread it was stated that the arguments were all too one-sided against Scientology. Really, it's almost impossible for anyone educated about it to have anything nice to say, because the "religion" (I know the UK doesn't offically recognize it as a religion, I don't think America does either, at least for tax purposes) gives nothing good to say about itself, other than the promise that you'll love it if you join. Anything else they mention about themselves is nothing but vague nonsense which amounts to absolutely nothing.
I don't think Scientology is a religion in the UK (I'm not sure
As for religion and cults. In my eyes the difference between a religion and cult isn't so much about their ideologies but more to do with their structure. With a religion you do not HAVE to pay (it's only an option). And they will teach the ways for more or less nothing. On the other hand a cult will force you to pay money to join their group. Once in you then need to make a significant investment to go up the ladder. This doesn't happen with normal religions. You progress through the rankings via faithful service. Finally another thing that distinguishes religions from cults is the fact the many cults eventually force its followers to leave the general population. So it's followers become isolated from non followers.
As Scientology follows all these cult traits, in my eyes it is closer to a cult than a religion. Then again I don't mind calling it a business!
